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[Selroth]

Now, first off I'm not going to post the draft agreement unless everyone likes it.  But, I really really doubt that's gonna happen.  Either way, I wanna start it off with this :)

This is what new members see as they enter their personal details while signing up for the site:

   Welcome to Draconity.org!  I'm not going to waste your time with the standard “Terms of Agreement” bullshit, or even “site rules”.  I shouldn't have to remind you that posts are property of their posters and that kinda crap.  I think it's much more important that I let you know what this website is about, and how we roll.

   This website was originally created to be a home for those who experience “draconity” in some shape or form.  Personally, I define draconity as having an affinity for dragons.  Understandably, most of our members will fit that description.  It is not a requirement to subscribe to the beliefs you'll come across here, but it is a requirement that you remain compatible with the website.  Basically, this is a slick way of me saying I ban you for whatever reason I want, bullshit or not (don't worry - this is an extremely rare occurrence). 

   How are we different from any other dragony or otherkin-y touchy-feely “hug me” forum?  Well, if you haven't figured that out yet then you're just a retard.  I'm offering everyone here more freedom of speech, more relaxed “at home” feel, and giving you the opportunity to be yourself!  Unfortunately for you, I like to be fair so I offer the vast majority of the community the same opportunity.  This means there will be and has been conflict (and most the time it's bloody hilarious).  So, if you haven't matured socially nor want to, then you may not have a pleasant experience.

This should stir up some debate :)

[Ethelshai]

I'd probably replace "bullshit" and "crap" by more formal words, but it sounds good globally.

[Aurelia]

LMAO!  Sel...  Where do I even begin?! Lol!

*takes a deep breath to stop laughing about the agreement post* right... hehehe...

First off, swearing on the forum is one thing - and something that can easily be told about in the agreement so people expect it - but you can't swear in an agreement when there could be really young children reading it!  The policy here is for noone under 13 to join right?  Well having swearing in an agreement that's shown BEFORE you're accepted just opens a whole bucket of legal worms about exposing young children to words they shouldn't know.  It can't be done and I don't think we should be promoting that ideal.

Secondly, I may have laughed at it because I know you and it really amused me no end, but that's one intimidating registration agreement!  "..I ban you for whatever reason I want.." - It doesn't matter what you prefix or suffix that statement with, it will be all prospective members will see and the site will be losing people right away.

I'll reword your post as to how I'd write it and see what you (and everyone else) thinks:

Welcome to Draconity.org!  I'm not going to waste your time with the standard "Terms of Agreement" or "site rules" because we've all been there before and know that posts are the property of their posters, etc.  I think it's much more important that I let you know what this website is about!

Draconity.org was originally created to be a home for those who experience "draconity" in some shape or form.  Personally, I define draconity as having an affinity for dragons, others may feel their draconity comes from their soul or a host of different other explanations.  It is not a requirement to subscribe to the beliefs you'll come across here, but it is a requirement that you remain compatible with the website.  This gives us the option of banning people we feel are detrimental to the community, for whatever reason (don't worry, this is extremely rare).

How are we different from any other dragony or otherkin-y touchy-feely "hug me" forum?  Well, we're offering everyone here more freedom of speech, a more relaxed "at home" feel and giving you the opportunity to be yourself!  Freedom of speech of course means everyone's speech not just your own, so being open to criticism is important as not everyone will share the same viewpoint.  This means there will be, and has been, conflict over topics and it opens up a whole new world for discussion without fear of threads being closed because they became "too heated".

We hope you enjoy your time here and that our more open speech policy benefits those who have matured socially or are looking to do so.

Hmm writing that out made me reaslise we aren't actually asking them to agree to anything in there.  So maybe some of the standard things do need to be said for them to actually "agree" to.

[Selroth]

Noooo!!! My cuss words!!!  LOL, ok, we'll remove them if you want, but I will point out we're not going to get in legal trouble over cuss words in our registration agreement.  I think the benefits of doing so and setting us apart is greater than "being safe from upset mommies" 

Besides, if they take offense to seeing swear words there, then they sure as hell aren't going to have a good time in our community.  I don't care what they're age is, but I can't ask if they're mentally over XX age or not. 

So here's my revision (since I liked some of the chances you've made):

Welcome to Draconity.org!  I'm not going to waste your time with the standard "Terms of Agreement" bullshit because we've all been there before and know that posts are the property of their posters, etc.  I think it's much more important that I let you know what this website is about!

Draconity.org was originally created to be a home for those who experience "draconity" in some shape or form.  Personally, I define draconity as having an affinity for dragons, others may feel their draconity comes from their soul or a host of different other explanations.  It is not a requirement to subscribe to the beliefs you'll come across here, but it is a requirement that you remain compatible with the community.  So, you're not agreeing to these beliefs or opinions, but you are required to agree to the community's intent.

How are we different from any other dragony or otherkin-y touchy-feely "hug me" forum?  Well, we're offering everyone here more freedom of speech, a more relaxed "at home" feel and giving you the opportunity to be yourself!  Freedom of speech of course means everyone's speech  - not just your own.  So being open to criticism, and having mature social skills, is important to ensure a pleasurable experience.  This means there will be, and has been, conflict over topics.  We open a whole new world of discussion without fear of threads being closed because they became "too heated".  If you feel you're too much of a pussy to do participate, then we advice you do not click “I agree.”

We hope you enjoy your time here and that our style of moderation (or looseness of) benefits those who have matured socially or are looking to become so.  If this is you, then elaborate on the Draconity and Biography text fields above to improve your chances of being accepted into the community by an administrator.  If not, then feel free to see which of our Sister Sites is more appealing to you.

[PhantomDragon]

Selroth got me thinking on the draft agreement. To my thinking and opinion, I think he added those swear words in there on purpose to catch our attention and have a place to start. I don't really think he would actually have those words in the actual agreement itself in the first place. Personally I don't think he added those intimidating agreements as well for the same reason. To me this is more of a test on what we think what should and should not be in the agreement, after all this an opinion of mine.

[Selroth]

I don't really think he would actually have those words in the actual agreement itself in the first place.

Oooooh yeah I would :)


But, you're more or less right.  Hence why I opened this up for public discussion and not just went right to posting it.  I knew no one would like those, and that'd be the first thing to go.  But I certainly don't want the point of them being put in there to be lost.

[Aurelia]

Selroth got me thinking on the draft agreement. To my thinking and opinion, I think he added those swear words in there on purpose to catch our attention and have a place to start. I don't really think he would actually have those words in the actual agreement itself in the first place. Personally I don't think he added those intimidating agreements as well for the same reason. To me this is more of a test on what we think what should and should not be in the agreement, after all this an opinion of mine.

Wrong Lol!  I've no doubt that he wants the swear words in, especially as he's just re-added them and even more derogatory terms into a revision of my revision *roll eyes*

Selroth:

No way am I ever going to agree to having the line "If you feel you're too much of a pussy to participate..." :P  It feels like you're putting swear words into the agreement just for the sake of having them there.  They don't add anything other than intimidation and does actually look like they're being added just to look big and clever - which they don't :P

You started your post saying you'd remove them and then in the revision have put them back and a new one! Urgh!

So I submit to you my revised-revision of your new revision lol:

Welcome to Draconity.org!  I'm not going to waste your time with the standard "Terms of Agreement" or "site rules" because we've all been there before and know that posts are the property of their posters, etc.  I think it's much more important that I let you know what this website is about!

Draconity.org was originally created to be a home for those who experience "draconity" in some shape or form.  Personally, I define draconity as having an affinity for dragons, others may feel their draconity comes from their soul or a host of different other explanations.  It is not a requirement to subscribe to the beliefs you'll come across here, but it is a requirement that you remain compatible with the website.  So, you're not agreeing to these beliefs or opinions but you are required to agree to the community's intent.

How are we different from any other dragony or otherkin-y touchy-feely "hug me" forum?  Well, we're offering everyone here more freedom of speech, a more relaxed "at home" feel and giving you the opportunity to be yourself!  Freedom of speech of course means everyone's speech, not just your own.   So being open to criticism and having mature social skills are equally important to ensure a pleasurable experience, as not everyone will share the same viewpoint.  This means there will be, and has been, conflict over topics and it opens up a whole new world for discussion without fear of threads being closed because they became "too heated".  If you feel you don't want, or don't like, to be challenged then we advise you do NOT click "I agree".

We hope you enjoy your time here and that our looser style of moderation benefits those who have matured socially or are looking to do so.  If this is you, then elaborate on the Draconity and Biography text fields above to improve your chances of being accepted into the community by an administrator.  If not, then feel free to see which of our sister sites is more appealing to you.

If you feel you don't want, or don't like, to be challenged then we advise you do NOT click "I agree". <--that line still isn't 100% right. Maybe someone can come up with something?

[Selroth]

Looks good Aure.  That'll be posted tomorrow if no one has any objections?

[Tysha]

I have to say I much prefer Aurelia's re-write of the agreement, I'm not keen on swearing or aggressiveness just for the sake of it either.

But yes, I like the agreement in Aurelia's last post.

[Cel]

Ok, here is my opinion. There isn't any reason really to worry about words like bullshit and crap, most kids these days over the age of 8 know words worse than that, I've heard it everywhere. If they can't take some blunt information, they shouldn't be here. I see no reason to soften the blow of something for someone because they're too "sensitive". I have to agree with Selroth and his original agreement. *nods* There is far worse on the web that is easier to find than a few swear words and blunt statements.

[J'Karrah]

Personally, I like Selroth's original version... "bullshit" and all.  But then again I find myself getting less and less tolerant of the typical otherkin-y touchy-feely "hug me" crap that seems to be infesting far too many forums.  However, the re-write is more... diplomatic. Which means it's probably the safer (not necessarily better, but safer) choice.

[Aurelia]

Ok, here is my opinion. There isn't any reason really to worry about words like bullshit and crap, most kids these days over the age of 8 know words worse than that, I've heard it everywhere. If they can't take some blunt information, they shouldn't be here. I see no reason to soften the blow of something for someone because they're too "sensitive". I have to agree with Selroth and his original agreement. *nods* There is far worse on the web that is easier to find than a few swear words and blunt statements.

Just because children can hear and read swearing all over the place, doesn't mean they should.  Also, just because other sites show it (and "much worse") doesn't mean we should be.  The argument of "everyone else does it" never holds any weight.

Personally, I like Selroth's original version... "bullshit" and all.  But then again I find myself getting less and less tolerant of the typical otherkin-y touchy-feely "hug me" crap that seems to be infesting far too many forums.  However, the re-write is more... diplomatic. Which means it's probably the safer (not necessarily better, but safer) choice.

Well we definitely want to change the typical touchy-feely "hug me" kind of vibe!  That isn't to say we won't allow hug threads - we're just opening up the community to more in depth discussion.  So everyone needs to be open to having their posts shot down as much as they are to having them agreed with or praised.  ...which I think everyone here seems to be on the right page about anyway, which is great! :D

But that said, a diplomatic registration agreement is going to make us more appealing and not just draw in narrow minded people who only want to join for a fight.  It's a fine line between having people here who are mature enough to fight for something they believe in (and/or to accept someone else's point of view) and having people join purely to shoot down other's ideas and only ever want to fight without bringing anything to the community.  Having a diplomatic initial representation of the site (as that is partly what the agreement/registration does - it isnt just for us to accept them, they have to accept us too) will keep a balanced influx of members.  Hopefully hehe :)

[Selroth]

Just because children can hear and read swearing all over the place, doesn't mean they should.  Also, just because other sites show it (and "much worse") doesn't mean we should be.  The argument of "everyone else does it" never holds any weight.

It does if the argument is keeping us out of trouble.  The best time to break a stupid law is when everyone else is breaking it too.  Besides, we're not doing it because everyone else it, we're doing it because everyone else isn't.  And personally, I don't give a rats ass for children who happen to stumble upon here as it doesn't happen nearly enough.

HOWEVER, as I just realized...

Swear words tend to ATTRACT children and unwanted guests.  And since I don't want those kind of people around, I'll leave the swear words out. 

[Aurelia]

It does if the argument is keeping us out of trouble.  The best time to break a stupid law is when everyone else is breaking it too.   

I disagree.  There HAS to be valid reasons for doing something (whatever it may be) and not just "...because everyone else is!"  But this strain of the discussion is getting really off topic hehe so I won't go into a big reply about it.

[gaydragon]

From what i read it seems fine 'to me for the most part,. and not sure if any charges need to be done but still good work.

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