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[Selroth]

Just one more thought for now...
Maybe is this correct, or you're looking at this in a different way, but I see a lot of 0 posts Members on the list.  Maybe this means that it is intimidating making an introduction post already? 

Spam bots make up the majority of those (those accounts were disabled, not deleted).  And another large portion are denied users (essentially the same effect).  The remaining small percent are the ultra-lurkers, or people who never returned to the site.

[Aurelia]

I keep thinking that the application process is necessary for the good health of an Otherkin forum. The purpose is not to intimidate newcomers with questions, but to try and see if they don't misunderstand the goals of this place. How many times have we encountered people who think they have found a RP forum ? I saw many cases of kids thinking they were playing a game and who hadn't even cared about serious/spiritual topics, eventually asking 6 months after joining "Btw what's an otherkin ?". So, for this reason, I think that the application system MUST be kept.
Now, about who decides of who is let in or not, I guess it's better to leave this to the staff (admins and mods). Because, the staff know about the inner workings of the community and are generally quite experienced. Moreover, if I was a newcomer to any place, I would certainly find it more intimidating to know that the application will be reviewed by anyone passing by. As a result, leaving this to the admins and mods is certainly not a foil to new members.

Also to expand on a point of Ethelshai's about the staff knowing the inner workings of the community.  Ultimately the staff are assigned their possitions because the community like, trust and respect those people to run the site and make it a great place to be.  A big part of that role is deciding who would benefit the community and who would be detrimental to it.

It's late and I've lost where my train of thought was going to finish that off.  Either way, the vast majority are so far against the mass-voting-introduction idea so as well as the arguments I (and others) have already put forwards, the members are obviously not wanting it implimented either.

[Carenath]

Probably rather late, and a bit of a moot point at this time of posting..

OT: Congrats on the new site/forum, its a massive improvement over the old system that was being used.

Regarding the Application system, I can only say that I am bitterly opposed to the idea, it is elitist, no matter how you try to slice it, or justify it.
While I can sympathise with the number of dragons who were around when their communities were ruined by "roleplayers" and trolls, and who happily support the system that (three times denied another dragon from joining a particular site (and my brother the first time)) means they can be a community onto themselves and painfully grill potential newcomers. It has the effect of making such communities elitist and unwelcoming.

Speaking only for myself, when I first awoke, I had a lot of questions, and quite a lot I was unsure of, it took me time to find my paws. I took one look at the registration policy on another site, and I shied away from it. I joined another who's staff didnt ask for my life story, and I was able to get the answers I needed, and then some. The failings of such registration systems, lie in the fact that an elite few get to view the registration forms and decide the user's fate. What if a member of the administration staff, dislikes the user for one reason or another, and decides to vote against them joining, perhaps submitting altered IRC logs as proof? For that poor member, its likely they will be rejected with prejudice.

Perhaps you could take advantage of the forum system in this. Allow the member to join, but grant them access on a probationary period. They are always free to chat to other members on the IRC to get to know everyone. Let them be free, not only to post an introduction post, but to post and respond to a small subsection of the forum.. a beginners area perhaps. They can always drop a PM to an admin and request "complete" access. If they are members on DR for example, it should not be an issue if they keep the same username. Say after a few days, review the member's participation in the community and grant them access to the rest. Just my two cents. I still hold the opinion, that rejecting one dragon, is one dragon too many, especially since my wingbrother was rejected from DragonRealms the first time he joined.

[Greylight]

I agree with Ethelshai here and would like to add another suggestion. An FAQ section with details surrounding what draconity is about and what we believe. The most problems I find coming to any new forum is starting out with little to no knowledge of what the place is about or the beliefs of the community I'm joining. Also make sure they know this is not a RPG site as there are many dragon based RPG's like AD&D and Dragonriders out there.

As for the interview process prior to joining I agree that admins should be the ones accepting new members. This being because admins are more likely to look at how well the individual would fit in and whether they have the right motives for joining instead of picking favorites. It also gives admins a chance to see if a prospective member is a hacker, spammer, or going to be overly harassing towards other members before they are accepted into the community. One webgroup I'm mod on we decided to accept new memberships but the individual had to fill out a basic questionaire sent by e-mail and send it filled out to the auto-return address. A similar system is used by Yahoo groups when setting a group to "private" and seems to work really well. The admins and site owners get an e-mail with the completed form and get to review it for consideration before letting anyone join. It contains questions like "Why do you want to join ______?" Where the blank is replaced with the webgroups name. For here it could also include something along the lines of "What is your opinion about dragons?" Basically the way this works is they type in their name and e-mail address and click on a web button that takes them to a page explaining that an e-mail has been sent to them and they must fill out the information and send it back prior to membership. Could also include a second line of text stating the e-mail will be viewed by admins only if you want.

That's my recommendation. Feel free to comment or make changes here.


Greylight S.

[Selroth]

Understanding the content and goals of the site is indeed something important.  And we have more than enough experience filtering out RPers and such (imagine the hassle we had with our former name, Draconomicon!), but nothing's perfect and the line gets fuzzy. 

What seems to be our primary problem isn't lack of knowledge of what the site is about (though that may be a contributing factor), but that people aren't going to be bothered by reading much of anything - they hardly care enough to fill out 2 question boxes with mroe than 2 words.  So, rather and slapping an agreement, FAQ, or such like that in their face, we need to throw something out there to capture their interest.  And often that has to lay beyond the lands of the site itself - advertising. 

The people we want more in our community are the people who want to be here.

[Greylight]

Hmmm, most people don't like being asked if they want to be on a site when they want to join. As far as the advertising part goes that depends alot on the members like myself. What I've been doing is the people I know would be interested in joining based on my knowledge of this site and what we're about I tell them about this site. let them know it's here on the net and give them a link to it. That way they know we're here and accepting new members.

The number one question I get about any site from prospective members is about safety and the attitude of the community as a whole. If there's alot of head-bashing going on most people don't want to join. At the same time it's important not to let it get too laid back on the rules. Newcomers will come here and hear about what rules there are from older members or in the FAQ if they know them at all. Having too many rules broken on a regular basis will lead them to believe the staff doesn't care about the site. Probably most importantly here is to be patient with newcomers and help them in learning the site. Where things are, how things work, what rules need to be followed if they don't know them, and getting to know a few members if they want too socialize. That's my opinion based on 10 years experience online.



Greylight S.

[Zucadragon]

I'm curious really, what exactly is the function of the site ?.. Is it just a meeting place for dragons, if so, is it more spiritual oriented, or perhaps more fun oriented, or just a relax bar in cyber space ?

I think that the way you build the application process depends on what you expect and want from new members.. For the spiritual side of the site, it's a good idea to push the members to write about their spiritual experience, their growth, their doubts, just so its a good basis to well, talk about and explore with.

For a fun site, having something like that wouldn't be needed, so the emphasis on "having a mod accept an application" wouldn't be needed if the profiles themselves aren't so much an important function.

Thats just my two cents.

[Selroth]

We're more like the bar in cyberspace I suppose.  Just a place for like-minded people to gather and enjoy eachother's company, since being 'kin or having such a strong affinity for dragons tends to leave one feeling a bit lonely for some reason.

It's REALLY hard to get people to put more than 1 or 2 sentences in an application - it's hard enough to get them to say anything at all.  Really, we just want enough to ensure us they're not a bot, troll, or just too immature to provide anything to the community.  It's surprisingly easy to tell the difference between who we welcome and the very few we turn away.  And those we do turn away I'm sure could care less.

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